THINKERS MARCH 13 2012: SL AND SEXUAL PERMISIVENESS

Extropia DaSilva: Welcome to Thinkers!
[2012/03/13 15:32]  Extropia DaSilva: Today the discussion topic is…
[2012/03/13 15:32]  Extropia DaSilva: SL AND SEXUAL PERMISIVENESS: Throughout history, some cultures have allowed sexual non-conformists to thrive, while others clamped down on their social freedoms or confined them to certain districts. Which is SL most like?
[2012/03/13 15:33]  Jamie Marlin: Both??
[2012/03/13 15:33]  Extropia DaSilva: Is that possible?
[2012/03/13 15:33]  Ivy Sunkiller: yes if you go to religious sims
[2012/03/13 15:33]  Scarp Godenot: I think they are much more in the sexual liberal category than not.
[2012/03/13 15:33]  Toy (aeni.silvercloud): Toy points at herself
[2012/03/13 15:33]  Scarp Godenot: haha
[2012/03/13 15:33]  Ivy Sunkiller: yes
[2012/03/13 15:33]  Zobeid Zuma: Zobeid Zuma cannot see Toy. 😛
[2012/03/13 15:33]  Toy (aeni.silvercloud): aw 😉
[2012/03/13 15:34]  Alexi Flux: I didn’t know there were historical sexual non comformists
[2012/03/13 15:34]  Ivy Sunkiller: I don’t need to say anything, I brought toy
[2012/03/13 15:34]  Ivy Sunkiller: :p
[2012/03/13 15:34]  Scarp Godenot: Several of the larger OpenSim Worlds are much more restrictive for example.
[2012/03/13 15:34]  Alexi Flux: Whe were they
[2012/03/13 15:34]  Zobeid Zuma: Hi Rhi! We saved you a chair!
[2012/03/13 15:34]  Jamie Marlin: SL is not really a single place? There are bits of SL that are very conformist… and the rest of us just ignore them
[2012/03/13 15:34]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Zo! Thank you!
[2012/03/13 15:34]  Scarp Godenot: I think Ancient Rome was filled with sexual nonconformists by todays standards….. heh
[2012/03/13 15:35]  Scarp Godenot: Just look at their art
[2012/03/13 15:35]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Thanks for the tp, Extie
[2012/03/13 15:35]  Extropia DaSilva: NP Rhi!
[2012/03/13 15:35]  Zobeid Zuma: Well, keep in mind that SL probably has its own mores that are independent from 1st Life. And yes, there are subcultures within SL. So… It’s complicated.
[2012/03/13 15:35]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Oh, the topic is whether sl promotes or suppresses social deviation?
[2012/03/13 15:35]  Extropia DaSilva: Yes Rhi, pretty much.
[2012/03/13 15:36]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Well, nudity isn’t exactly sexual deviation, but SL treats you like an outsider if yoiu’re a nudist
[2012/03/13 15:36]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Except for the nudits ghettos
[2012/03/13 15:36]  Ivy Sunkiller: well, adult sims were excluded into their own ghetto mainland
[2012/03/13 15:36]  Ivy Sunkiller: and as a matter of a fact, I came to SL for the perverse stuff
[2012/03/13 15:36]  Scarp Godenot: I think LL has walked the line well between giving those who are sexually oriented lots of freedom while still having it possible for the more conservative to have their own areas and experiences.
[2012/03/13 15:36]  Jamie Marlin: On the whole… I think that SL is more sexualized, perhaps? But for the vast majority of people, I think it is a pretty conventional sexuality
[2012/03/13 15:36]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Even when it’s not explicit, it distorts people’s perception of you
[2012/03/13 15:37]  Ivy Sunkiller: I see banners of VR sex services on all porn websites
[2012/03/13 15:37]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Rhiannon of the Birds agrees with Scarp but with reservations
[2012/03/13 15:37]  Ivy Sunkiller: if LL advertised SL as a place of sexual liberty, the userbase would grow tenfold
[2012/03/13 15:38]  Extropia DaSilva: Does it not have that reputation already?
[2012/03/13 15:38]  Scarp Godenot: Ivy: that is becoming really common. I think VR sex is a killer app for future virtual world development.
[2012/03/13 15:38]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Ivy, or it might shrink; a lot of placaes have gone PG just to be restrcitive
[2012/03/13 15:38]  Jamie Marlin: (I admit that I avoid most of the conventional club scene and I am WAY more comfortable with the deviants, so perhaps I am not seeing everything)
[2012/03/13 15:39]  Ivy Sunkiller: Rhi: I seriously doubt it will shrink, for every jesus prayer group member that leaves, you will get 20 who want to get a fat cock in their <insert hole here>
[2012/03/13 15:39]  Scarp Godenot: I don’t engage in the SLex scene at all, and hardly ever encounter it, unless I were to look for it….
[2012/03/13 15:39]  Zobeid Zuma: My observations of the furry community have been…. interesting… in this regard.
[2012/03/13 15:39]  Extropia DaSilva: *pouts* You never take *me*
[2012/03/13 15:39]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Well, to partly reinterate wht others have said; there are ghettos in SL for sexual deviants; and I know for a fact that I generate hostility some places, so innocuous things I say get totally blown out of proportion.
[2012/03/13 15:40]  Scarp Godenot: Is Zindra really a ghetto? I don’t think so.
[2012/03/13 15:40]  Logical Dilemma (multimuse): I have seen the deviants become the norm in SL. Where I may get a sideways glance and curious murmurs if I admit to not having done something (like ever using a dildo). So, I wonder what exactly we can define as a deviance and a norm in SL.
[2012/03/13 15:40]  Extropia DaSilva: You say that Scarp. But I have seen the look you and Artcrash exchange when you think nobody is looking.
[2012/03/13 15:40]  Scarp Godenot: haha
[2012/03/13 15:40]  Scarp Godenot: caught me
[2012/03/13 15:41]  Zobeid Zuma: I remember when my favorite sandbox was taken over by fatfur pokemorphs. That was an eye-opener. 😛
[2012/03/13 15:41]  Extropia DaSilva: That is a good point. Is there such a thing as a sexual deviant in SL?
[2012/03/13 15:41]  Scarp Godenot: I need to look up that term! ha ha
[2012/03/13 15:41]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Zo! No. What happened?
[2012/03/13 15:42]  Zobeid Zuma: Well, after I gave up trying to claw my virtual eyes out, I went in search of another sandbox.
[2012/03/13 15:42]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Extie, yes, there are those who the majority of people in SL look askance at. Again, I think, although it’s not a sexual deviation, nudism shows that.
[2012/03/13 15:42]  Scarp Godenot: Zob, you are always welcome to use my sandbox..
[2012/03/13 15:42]  Jamie Marlin: There are quite a few people who view Gor as Deviant
[2012/03/13 15:43]  Extropia DaSilva: Ah, good point, sis.
[2012/03/13 15:43]  Jamie Marlin: and yet it is one of the strongest subcultures here
[2012/03/13 15:43]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Jamie, good point, Gorean manners are not liked outside of Gor
[2012/03/13 15:43]  Zobeid Zuma: Gor is sick. 😛
[2012/03/13 15:43]  Ember (cylania): I think the prevalence of Gor here has less people shaking their heads than would in RL tho.
[2012/03/13 15:43]  Extropia DaSilva: why is that, Zo?
[2012/03/13 15:43]  Zobeid Zuma: Because everything they believe and do is sick. That’s why.
[2012/03/13 15:43]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Emberi, I think it is tolerated here, but it has to be confined.
[2012/03/13 15:44]  Jamie Marlin: Jamie Marlin remembers the Gor / Furry wars of 2004
[2012/03/13 15:44]  Scarp Godenot: I think ALL of us would be surprised to explore the depth of many of the groups here that we are unfamiliar with. Just as an example: the victorian steampunks. Amazing subculture that is HUGE.
[2012/03/13 15:44]  Enigma Bombay: Gor is mostly elaborate RP
[2012/03/13 15:44]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Jamie, a little before my time, but furries are considered deviants
[2012/03/13 15:44]  Zobeid Zuma: A couple of days ago I went to Ahern (I’m not sure why I do this to myself)…. And in the middle of the crowd was a naked fox av…. with his oversized junk…. running a masturbation anim….
[2012/03/13 15:44]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): By a lot of people
[2012/03/13 15:44]  Extropia DaSilva: How can you be my little sister if you rezzed a year before me, Jamie?
[2012/03/13 15:44]  Ember (cylania): Well, when in Rome… agreed. But I don’t think there are so many folks who are as shocked to see that form of interaction here. I know at first, I was freaked by Gor. Now I just look at it as part of a whole spectrum of different sexual genres.
[2012/03/13 15:44]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Zoe, what’a Ahern?
[2012/03/13 15:44]  Zobeid Zuma: And I was like: Is this guy really *that* messed up, or is he a troll who gets a laugh out of giving furries a bad name?
[2012/03/13 15:45]  Zobeid Zuma: Ahern is the original SL Welcome Area where everybody used to start.
[2012/03/13 15:45]  Zobeid Zuma: I reported him of course, but…. daaayum.
[2012/03/13 15:45]  Enigma Bombay: Ahern is a feeding frenzy now, nothing like it was back when SL was in beta.
[2012/03/13 15:45]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Yeah, that was uncool in a welcome area
[2012/03/13 15:45]  Zobeid Zuma: That’s a “General” area.
[2012/03/13 15:45]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Yeah, so his behavior was SL deviant
[2012/03/13 15:46]  Scarp Godenot: There are more than twice as many Estate Sims than there are Mainland Sims. And Each of those owners can choose their own flavor of sexuality or whatever. The Lab doesn’t clamp down or regulate them at all.
[2012/03/13 15:46]  Enigma Bombay: no, and they shouldn’t regulate, I dont’ think
[2012/03/13 15:47]  Extropia DaSilva: Am I right in saying that people who want sex in whatever form, by and large prefer to do it in private places like skyboxes? So it is like a self-censorship rather than SL dictating?
[2012/03/13 15:47]  Scarp Godenot: But they don’t and that is the point. They aren’t repressive.
[2012/03/13 15:47]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Rhiannon of the Birds urbs her eyes; everything has rezzed except Jamie’s hair
[2012/03/13 15:47]  Zobeid Zuma: Don’t overlook all the exhibitionists, Extie. 😛
[2012/03/13 15:47]  Alexi Flux: Well, Scarp, each resident has their own posibiity to say what thjey think of different behaviours
[2012/03/13 15:47]  Miracle Masala: Hello everyone 🙂
[2012/03/13 15:47]  Extropia DaSilva: Hello
[2012/03/13 15:47]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): hi Miracle!
[2012/03/13 15:47]  Enigma Bombay: things have changed since they brought the teen grid back into main SL, and they implemented Adult sims
[2012/03/13 15:47]  darcon Xue: Hello love 🙂
[2012/03/13 15:47]  Jamie Marlin: There are many many public sex areas, sis
[2012/03/13 15:48]  Alexi Flux: But I am always getting banned, or ejected
[2012/03/13 15:48]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Alexi, why are you always getting banned or ejected?
[2012/03/13 15:48]  Enigma Bombay: I think LL will still regulate when it comes to “ageplay.”
[2012/03/13 15:48]  Alexi Flux: Because I opn my mouth
[2012/03/13 15:48]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Enigma, as well as sim owners
[2012/03/13 15:48]  Extropia DaSilva: I went to a few a long time ago, Jamie. Xa took me.
[2012/03/13 15:48]  Ember (cylania): I should hope so, Enigma.
[2012/03/13 15:48]  Scarp Godenot: A few friends and I went to several strip clubs in SL, and for giggles, stripped down and counted how long it took us to get booted! It was like a couple of minutes at most…. ha ha
[2012/03/13 15:48]  Miracle Masala: oops, sorry
[2012/03/13 15:48]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): oh, and you say what?
[2012/03/13 15:48]  Jamie Marlin: Enigma: Yes – but that is due to outside law, I think
[2012/03/13 15:49]  Zobeid Zuma: Anyhow, in the furry world there are *many* areas catering to various kinds of deviated preversions, and there are only a couple of PG-rated furry hangouts — but those are a couple of the most popular. So that’s an odd dynamic, perhaps.
[2012/03/13 15:49]  Enigma Bombay: yes, most sim owners back away from any association with ageplay because it can cause charges to be brought against them
[2012/03/13 15:49]  Alexi Flux: I say what I think, but usually I just ask people why, Rhi
[2012/03/13 15:49]  Alexi Flux: So I can understand
[2012/03/13 15:50]  Alexi Flux: and I defend my own values
[2012/03/13 15:50]  Scarp Godenot: Ageplay is the thing that worries LL the most. There are political forces out there that would love to shut down anything on the internet related to this topic. And some of those forces are powerful…
[2012/03/13 15:50]  Jamie Marlin: When SL created the ‘Adult’ designation, there was a huge controversy. Does anyone know what the relative popularity / population of the Adult / Mature / PG area is?
[2012/03/13 15:50]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): I’ve been banned from one place for pointing out that I was banned (all my alts got banned then), and from another for just asking if I could be naked in the sim
[2012/03/13 15:50]  Enigma Bombay: Yes, it’s really one of the few taboos in SL, Scarp.
[2012/03/13 15:51]  Alexi Flux: Banning is just a sign of insecurity, Rhi
[2012/03/13 15:51]  Extropia DaSilva: Rhi it sounds like nudity is second only to Ageplay in terms of what is deemed to be not acceptable.
[2012/03/13 15:51]  Scarp Godenot: That would be interesting to know Jamie. As far as mainland goes, those numbers are determined by LL. I think most Estate sims are Mature, but I’m just guessing.
[2012/03/13 15:52]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Extropia, I think so.
[2012/03/13 15:52]  Scarp Godenot: I made sure to have a mature sim when I bought this one, so I could display controversial art.
[2012/03/13 15:52]  Jamie Marlin: It seems odd to me that in many places nudity will get you banned while being leashed is perfectly acceptable
[2012/03/13 15:52]  Alexi Flux: Well, Rhi, I consider nudity really sexless
[2012/03/13 15:52]  Logical Dilemma (multimuse): I’ve been to many sims where nudity is encouraged. The problem is that there is a difference between LL repression and a landowners repression.
[2012/03/13 15:52]  Extropia DaSilva: But all this banning is, I assume, done by the owner of the sim not Linden Lab. So…what does that say about the permisiveness of SL ITSELF. Can we speak of that apart from the actions of its residents?
[2012/03/13 15:53]  Ivy Sunkiller: clothes are sexier than nudity
[2012/03/13 15:53]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Jamie, that is odd, but I’ve found that nudity is more acceptable than a collar and a leash. A lot of places make an exception for me, because “You’re just naked.”
[2012/03/13 15:53]  Alexi Flux: It’swhen you hide nudity with clothing that it becomes erotic
[2012/03/13 15:53]  Extropia DaSilva: I agree, Ivy. I am quite ugly naked. I look much sexier when dressed.
[2012/03/13 15:53]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Alexi, Ivy, you’re absolutely right. It’s a lot more erotic to have sexy clothes on
[2012/03/13 15:53]  Scarp Godenot: Extie, I don’t think we can generalize about the total population of SL, and that is a great thing, I think. Lots of diversity.
[2012/03/13 15:53]  Enigma Bombay: People have been asking for some form of all-inclusive representative government in SL from the beginning, and it’s not feasible… LL pays for the servers, and private parties pay for tier… it’s their choice, it’s not a public space.
[2012/03/13 15:54]  Jamie Marlin: 🙂 I was collared and leased full time for several years and rarely encountered any issues. But that may have more to do with where I went?
[2012/03/13 15:54]  Alexi Flux: I am often naked when on holiday, also when I work outside
[2012/03/13 15:54]  Scarp Godenot: Whenever I take off my shirt, my friends give me shit because I have one of those ripped ab skins! haha
[2012/03/13 15:54]  Extropia DaSilva: It is true. I payed a fortune for her.
[2012/03/13 15:55]  Jamie Marlin: *smiles!* Did not!
[2012/03/13 15:55]  Enigma Bombay: That’s interesting, because in Gorean auctions, the “money” paid for slaves is roleplayed only, in my understanding.
[2012/03/13 15:55]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Scarp, I’ve gotten a lot of free clothes by being nake.d A lot of people seem to assume that I’m nakeed because I can’t afford clothes
[2012/03/13 15:55]  Scarp Godenot: En: that is right, Long ago I was involved with the SL government project, and it just wasn’t feasable at all….
[2012/03/13 15:56]  Enigma Bombay: Scarp, were you part of the experiment that Ulrika Zugzwang was heading up?
[2012/03/13 15:56]  Scarp Godenot: ha ha Rhi,
[2012/03/13 15:56]  Jamie Marlin: Enigma: Yes – you are right. The auctions are almost entirely role-play
[2012/03/13 15:56]  Extropia DaSilva: I do remember once that an individual kicked up a huge stink about Toy and Ivy. They were not doing anything except for Toy being chained to Ivy. This person thought it was terrible and I should ban them. I did not, of course.
[2012/03/13 15:56]  Scarp Godenot: Back in 2008
[2012/03/13 15:56]  Zobeid Zuma: Yeah, that was probably me. 😛
[2012/03/13 15:56]  Alexi Flux: So, all these “deviant” groups, how do they influence new, young, vulnerable newbies to SL?
[2012/03/13 15:57]  Jamie Marlin: Opening their eyes, I hope?
[2012/03/13 15:57]  Scarp Godenot: Alexi, a LOT of SL newbies aren’t that young! heh
[2012/03/13 15:57]  Enigma Bombay: I think many people come to SL to be part of these groups, they aren’t necessarily “swayed” or “corrupted” by them upon arrival.
[2012/03/13 15:57]  Alexi Flux: Wel I don’t know Scarp, they look young
[2012/03/13 15:58]  Zobeid Zuma: Haha! 🙂
[2012/03/13 15:58]  Scarp Godenot: I think the median age of SL residents is 35. heh, and yes they do look much younger than their Actual ages
[2012/03/13 15:58]  Scarp Godenot: hah
[2012/03/13 15:58]  Extropia DaSilva: Well the first peoples I met in SL were the furries. But I did not know about their sexual reputation and it was not at all obvious from what I saw. First thing a furry did with me was play chess. I lost.
[2012/03/13 15:58]  Alexi Flux: Well, I have touched people who I suspect are here to explore cult groups
[2012/03/13 15:58]  Jamie Marlin: I was. (corrupted, I mean) I experimented a LOT when I first arrived here.
[2012/03/13 15:58]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Extie, people always lose to furries, that’s why they don’t like them
[2012/03/13 15:59]  Extropia DaSilva: I liked them. Nice crowd. Very talented builders.
[2012/03/13 15:59]  Enigma Bombay: In my SL experience, not all furries are overtly sexual; we also had the Something Awful Goons attacking furries in SL back in 2005 or so, that was a big mess and LL banned a bunch of the SA goons.
[2012/03/13 15:59]  Extropia DaSilva: Do you still experiment, Jamie?
[2012/03/13 15:59]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Engima, I’ve never associated furries with anything overly sexual. Now, ,ocelots? That’s another story. ::winks at Zo::
[2012/03/13 15:59]  Zobeid Zuma: It depends on where you go. Luskwood is G-rated, and very popular. Northstar on the other hand…
[2012/03/13 16:00]  Jamie Marlin: 🙂 I have a much better idea of who I am and what I like now. So it isn’t ‘experimenting’ any more
[2012/03/13 16:00]  Zobeid Zuma: Hey thanks Rhi. 😀
[2012/03/13 16:00]  Scarp Godenot: I suspect the SL furries who are actual RL furries might be more sexual in SMaybe?
[2012/03/13 16:00]  Extropia DaSilva: On a personal note I experimented in my early days but then met one or two people I loved and…well after that sex with strangers really looses its appeal.
[2012/03/13 16:00]  Zobeid Zuma: Zobeid Zuma tries to figure out the difference between SL and RL furries??
[2012/03/13 16:01]  Enigma Bombay: well, it depends on whether it’s an actual fetish or just the way they want to project themselves… many furries choose to be furry because they want to avoid sexualization, especially the subset of tiny furries.
[2012/03/13 16:01]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): oh, yeah, Jamie’s hair has rezzed. You look a lot better with a full head of hair, Jamie, than with strandds sticking out. Just fyi.
[2012/03/13 16:01]  Scarp Godenot: True En
[2012/03/13 16:01]  Jamie Marlin: *sticks out her tongue at Rhi!*
[2012/03/13 16:01]  Extropia DaSilva: Is she picking on you, sis?
[2012/03/13 16:01]  Jamie Marlin: Yes!
[2012/03/13 16:01]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Rhiannon of the Birds giggles and winks at Jamie
[2012/03/13 16:02]  Extropia DaSilva: *GLARES* at Rhi.
[2012/03/13 16:02]  Enigma Bombay: Furries have always been excluded from formal dance clubs in SL, as well as people who aren’t dressed, er, formally.
[2012/03/13 16:02]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Not me. Just commenting on how slow things are to rez here.
[2012/03/13 16:02]  Alexi Flux: I never really had thought anything about ds until i had been in SL a while
[2012/03/13 16:02]  Alexi Flux: Then I saw how it wss everywhere in RL
[2012/03/13 16:02]  Scarp Godenot: Do you have a policy on that at your club, Enigma?
[2012/03/13 16:02]  Extropia DaSilva: what did you learn, Alexi?
[2012/03/13 16:03]  Enigma Bombay: nope Scarp, we don’t really care as long as no one is being hostile to others
[2012/03/13 16:03]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Enigma, you can said naked, although the PC term is nude.
[2012/03/13 16:03]  Alexi Flux: Well, I found it a quite fascinbating subject
[2012/03/13 16:03]  Alexi Flux: So many parallels in RL
[2012/03/13 16:03]  Enigma Bombay: I can say naked in regard to what, Rhiannon? I’m confused.
[2012/03/13 16:03]  Scarp Godenot: For those who don’t know, Enigma runs one of the most Awesome Indie music clubs in SL.
[2012/03/13 16:03]  Alexi Flux: But basically it hinges around insecurity, my thoughtantway, Extie
[2012/03/13 16:03]  Enigma Bombay: lol Scarp, thanks, we’ve really scaled back, though… I tend to hang out a lot at Velvet these days
[2012/03/13 16:04]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Oh, you were saying that some places exclude furries from formal dances, as well as peopole who aren’t “formally dressed.” I thought you were using a euphemism.
[2012/03/13 16:04]  Jamie Marlin: Alexi: DS, you mean?
[2012/03/13 16:04]  Enigma Bombay: no, I meant people who aren’t dressed in a manner deemed “formal” by the “management.”
[2012/03/13 16:04]  Alexi Flux: Yes, Jamie
[2012/03/13 16:04]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): oh, ok
[2012/03/13 16:04]  Enigma Bombay: I supposed “in the all together” would fall under that heading, though, Rhiannon. 😉
[2012/03/13 16:04]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Well, what if the furry were dressed ina top hat and tails or a gown? What then?
[2012/03/13 16:04]  Scarp Godenot: I think that dress requirement standard is true for the majority of
[2012/03/13 16:05]  Scarp Godenot: roleplay sims
[2012/03/13 16:05]  Jamie Marlin: Having lived with it… for me it hinges on trust and control. I LOVE the feeling of loosing control, and in SL I can do it safely
[2012/03/13 16:05]  Enigma Bombay: Formal clubs excluse furries, as far as I know, no matter how they are dressed… at least Frank’s and Phat Cat’s has, not sure about them all.
[2012/03/13 16:05]  Enigma Bombay: *exclude
[2012/03/13 16:05]  Zobeid Zuma: I’ve seen some RP sims where furries weren’t welcome because they break the theme, which I can kind of understand.
[2012/03/13 16:05]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Scarp, but not all; I can go to one role play sim naked, however, I have to role play the reason–cursed to nakedness by a witch
[2012/03/13 16:05]  Alexi Flux: Yes, so why do you have those needs, Jamie
[2012/03/13 16:05]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): That’s even my title there. “Cursed to nakedness.” Elves try to help me
[2012/03/13 16:06]  Zobeid Zuma: And then there are the Gor sims…. But furries and goreans are natural enemies anyhow. :/
[2012/03/13 16:06]  Alexi Flux: I dont talk about the mechanics….why are the needs there?
[2012/03/13 16:06]  Enigma Bombay: exactly, Zobeid… Gorean sims exclude furries, too, but they can also ask people to leave who aren’t dressed Gorean, so it’s RP – based.
[2012/03/13 16:06]  Jamie Marlin: You should go to the Blue Note – better music and all they ask is politeness and tolerance
[2012/03/13 16:06]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Jamie, one of the nice things about SL
[2012/03/13 16:06]  Extropia DaSilva: I like the Blue Note.
[2012/03/13 16:06]  Enigma Bombay: Nudity is perfectly welcome in any RP sim.
[2012/03/13 16:06]  Enigma Bombay: er, any Gorean sim.
[2012/03/13 16:07]  Zobeid Zuma: I can always go for Star Trek RP. They have an official feline race, although they aren’t seen often in the TV show. 🙂
[2012/03/13 16:07]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Enigma, no, not all. One medieval sim asked me to leave.
[2012/03/13 16:07]  Enigma Bombay: Rhiannon, I meant to say Gorean, sorry.
[2012/03/13 16:07]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): The Blue NOte? Would ththey let me in?
[2012/03/13 16:07]  Extropia DaSilva: Not naked, no.
[2012/03/13 16:08]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): oh, np, Enigma
[2012/03/13 16:08]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Gorean sim are the major rp sims
[2012/03/13 16:08]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Didn’t think so, Extie, for some reason blues places don’t want naked people in them.
[2012/03/13 16:08]  Scarp Godenot: There are LOTs of non gorean roleplay sims
[2012/03/13 16:08]  Enigma Bombay: I would love to know how many sim in SL are designated Gorean, I’ve heard there are something like 50K Goreans in SL.
[2012/03/13 16:08]  Jamie Marlin: Rhi – I am not certain. I think it is a PG sim
[2012/03/13 16:09]  Alexi Flux: What are Goreans, anybody?
[2012/03/13 16:09]  Extropia DaSilva: I am certain, sis. They have a notice at the entrance saying too much bare flesh is not allowed.
[2012/03/13 16:09]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Mamie, it’s ok; there seems to be a strong gymnophobia in blues and folk places
[2012/03/13 16:09]  Alexi Flux: I not got that far yet
[2012/03/13 16:09]  Zobeid Zuma: I’m boggled. I never heard of Gor before SL. Where did these people come from? 😛
[2012/03/13 16:09]  Scarp Godenot: There is a whole subculture of shooter and war sims.
[2012/03/13 16:09]  Enigma Bombay: Goreans are people who engage in RP based on a series of novels by John NOrman set in a fictional world called Gor.
[2012/03/13 16:09]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Zo, from the books by Howard
[2012/03/13 16:09]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): no, not howard, he’s Conan
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Alexi Flux: Oh, I am illiterate
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Alexi Flux: I don’t read books
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): And stdrangely, the first sim was created by a woman
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Extropia DaSilva: I went to one blues club with her *points at Jamie* and I got an IM from the owner saying my skirt was too short.
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Who was the creator of Gor. I’m having a brain fart
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Jamie Marlin: From books by John Norman.
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): yes, Norman. That’s it
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Enigma Bombay: there are almost 30 novels by John Norman, upon which Gor is based.
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Jamie Marlin: Really really REALLY poorly written books
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Enigma Bombay: yes, lol
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): I couldn’t read them; I tried one, but when they captured a feminist from Earth and turned her into a slave, and she loved it, I stopped reading
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Enigma Bombay: laughably poor
[2012/03/13 16:10]  Toy (aeni.silvercloud): haha, yes
[2012/03/13 16:11]  Scarp Godenot: Someone in SL said a skirt was too short? ha ha ha
[2012/03/13 16:11]  Jamie Marlin: from the standpoint of grammar and english composition at least
[2012/03/13 16:11]  Zobeid Zuma: From what I know of it, I can’t comprehend the appeal to anybody…. except maybe pathological misogynists.
[2012/03/13 16:11]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Jamie, they’r enot read for good writing. lol
[2012/03/13 16:11]  Enigma Bombay: Do the vampire RP folks welcome furries?
[2012/03/13 16:11]  Enigma Bombay: (beyond werewolves)
[2012/03/13 16:11]  Zobeid Zuma: Depends on the blood type, Enigma. 😀
[2012/03/13 16:11]  Enigma Bombay: heh
[2012/03/13 16:11]  Scarp Godenot: Tiny micro skirts outnumber longer ones ten to one at the fashion stores! heh
[2012/03/13 16:12]  Scarp Godenot: Oh yes, the vampire sims, they are legion.
[2012/03/13 16:12]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): heh, the ones in SL are mild compared to the books; a friend of mine got banned from Gorean sims for treating slaves the way they are treated in the books.
[2012/03/13 16:12]  Jamie Marlin: I know a number of people whom I *know* to be biologically female who play in gor.
[2012/03/13 16:12]  Zobeid Zuma: I remember when the vampires were hassling everybody, but that craze seems to have died down.
[2012/03/13 16:12]  Extropia DaSilva: Well in this club Scarp the dress code was ball gowns and evening dresses. I guess my Blaze Aqua dress was too risque.
[2012/03/13 16:12]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): And some epople like the life style, the fabrics, the buuildings, the jungle
[2012/03/13 16:12]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): hi Zimri!
[2012/03/13 16:13]  Scarp Godenot: It makes sense for submissives to Roleplay Gor.
[2012/03/13 16:13]  Jamie Marlin: I even know people who RP on gorean themes in RL… as in go away and dress up and play Gor for a weekend
[2012/03/13 16:13]  Zimri Topaz: hello.. Rhia
[2012/03/13 16:13]  Zimri Topaz: everyone
[2012/03/13 16:13]  Alexi Flux: What club was it Extie, I must go
[2012/03/13 16:13]  Zobeid Zuma: And the vampire fad was predicted decades earlier in SP Somtow’s “Mallworld” stories. Truly prophetic that.
[2012/03/13 16:13]  Extropia DaSilva: Bogart’s Jazz, Alexi.
[2012/03/13 16:13]  Alexi Flux: Oh, I might have been once
[2012/03/13 16:13]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Yeah, there is one Gorean sim whish is a “lifestyle” one; they like the clothes, the buildings, the musics, the styles. Not heavy into the role play
[2012/03/13 16:13]  Enigma Bombay: It does make sense for submissives to RP in Gor, but Gor isn’t just like bdsm… in fact some bdsm folks and Goreans intensely dislike each others’ cultures.
[2012/03/13 16:14]  Scarp Godenot: I wonder if there is a comprehensive lists of roleplay types for SL on the web somewhere…?
[2012/03/13 16:14]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Well, it seems we are no longer talking sexual deviation, but deviation in general
[2012/03/13 16:14]  Jamie Marlin: Jamie Marlin agrees with Enigma
[2012/03/13 16:14]  Zobeid Zuma: Maybe we could make a map of SL’s various sub-cultures and how they relate. That would be a fun project.
[2012/03/13 16:14]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Goreanism, vampirism, furries, republicanism
[2012/03/13 16:14]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Blues and Jazz clubs
[2012/03/13 16:14]  Jamie Marlin: Oooooh!
[2012/03/13 16:15]  Alexi Flux: Well, this RP stuff, it does come out of peoples heads, they do what they want to experience, so why is it called Role Play?
[2012/03/13 16:15]  Jamie Marlin: I want to RP Republicanism!
[2012/03/13 16:15]  Jamie Marlin: Is there a place you can buy the costumes?
[2012/03/13 16:15]  Enigma Bombay: the SecondLife Marketplace has some categories… Tiny, Goth, Gor, Fantasy, Vampire, Furry & Steampunk.
[2012/03/13 16:15]  Zobeid Zuma: I’ve been to the Republican sims, and I’ve been to some Democrat/Progressive events. That was…. enlightening.
[2012/03/13 16:15]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Alexi, because you’re assumiing a role; you’re not really a vampire, or a Gorean slave.
[2012/03/13 16:15]  Scarp Godenot: I think Philip Rosedale’s initial vision of SL is still largely true, and that is that it be open and accepting of all cultures.
[2012/03/13 16:16]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Zo, you’ll have to tell me sometime; I’ve gone to Republican sims, to test their beliefs in individual freedom, but no one is ever around
[2012/03/13 16:16]  Scarp Godenot: ha ha Rhi
[2012/03/13 16:16]  Extropia DaSilva: But that is crossing the electronic looking glass, Rhi. My PRIMARY role plays me, but I do not role play myself.
[2012/03/13 16:16]  Enigma Bombay: I think Philip was hoping for a true metaverse that would encompass and welcome more people from all over the world… SL is becoming niche in some ways.
[2012/03/13 16:16]  Jamie Marlin: Scarp – that is my favorite part of SL
[2012/03/13 16:16]  Alexi Flux: Well, I accept everyone, but I think it is all wrong as I am easily corrupted
[2012/03/13 16:16]  Zobeid Zuma: The republicans like to sit around a chat about how Obama is history’s greatest monster. The dems like to have a couple of speakers drone on about insanely boring details of legislation nobody cares about.
[2012/03/13 16:17]  Extropia DaSilva: I thought I was your favourite part of SL, sis?
[2012/03/13 16:17]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Extie, yes, we all play a role here, but that is different than role play
[2012/03/13 16:17]  Jamie Marlin: 🙂
[2012/03/13 16:17]  Jamie Marlin: You are my favorite part of… everything
[2012/03/13 16:18]  Scarp Godenot: Some of the ‘country specific sims’ such as Greeks or Brazilians or Japanese are very successful I have noticed. That at least works to some degree.
[2012/03/13 16:18]  Zobeid Zuma: But neither side gets much traction because, let’s face it, politics isn’t what most people come to SL for.
[2012/03/13 16:18]  darcon Xue: Thank you loves 🙂 Have a nice time 🙂
[2012/03/13 16:18]  Extropia DaSilva: But I think you could really be a Gorean in SL. Not merely role play.
[2012/03/13 16:18]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): tc, darcon!
[2012/03/13 16:19]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): oic, Extie, well, yes, but if you are too literal, you get booted from the sim.
[2012/03/13 16:19]  Zobeid Zuma: I do remember reading about a study to find out what the best selling items were…. genitals were near the top of the list.
[2012/03/13 16:19]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): I think some people are Gorean for aesthetic reasons, and they might be true goreans
[2012/03/13 16:19]  Zobeid Zuma: Although to be fair, they’d probably sell well in RL too if everybody didn’t come with them.
[2012/03/13 16:19]  Enigma Bombay: Not surprising, Zobeid 🙂
[2012/03/13 16:19]  Scarp Godenot: I would have guessed Hair, Zobeid….
[2012/03/13 16:20]  Jamie Marlin: I think that might be because there are relatively few options, compared to, say, hair
[2012/03/13 16:20]  Jamie Marlin: or shoes
[2012/03/13 16:20]  Zobeid Zuma: Well, that was a few years ago, so things may have changed.
[2012/03/13 16:21]  Zobeid Zuma: SL is dynamic, and we haven’t yet see where it’s all going.
[2012/03/13 16:21]  Extropia DaSilva: Why do we not just have genitals by default?
[2012/03/13 16:21]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Well, the first thing I’d do as a guy in SL would be to by a dick; men look awfully silly without them.
[2012/03/13 16:21]  Jamie Marlin: I know that I, personally, have way way WAY more shoes than genitals in my inventory
[2012/03/13 16:21]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Extie, probably to boost the SL economy
[2012/03/13 16:21]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Jamie, me too
[2012/03/13 16:21]  Zobeid Zuma: I have an antagonistic view towards footwear….
[2012/03/13 16:21]  Extropia DaSilva: Yeah but how many genitals does a person need, sis?
[2012/03/13 16:21]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): I have maybe two publes in my inventory.
[2012/03/13 16:21]  Alexi Flux: Took me ages to find some pubic hair
[2012/03/13 16:22]  Jamie Marlin: but… then… girls without prim genitals don’t look like they are missing something
[2012/03/13 16:22]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Zo, you wouldn’t iif they werae the only thing you were wearing
[2012/03/13 16:22]  Scarp Godenot: Extie, I think that the Lab made a political decision about genitals, And that was you can be sexual if you want, but the default is not to assume that is true for most.
[2012/03/13 16:22]  Zobeid Zuma: Haha! 🙂
[2012/03/13 16:22]  Zobeid Zuma: As I’ve said before, if I were ditching clothes, shoes would be the first thing to go, no the last. 🙂
[2012/03/13 16:22]  Extropia DaSilva: I got myself a sexy clit once. I stopped wearing it, though. It kept going off ‘oo…yeah..baby!’ and stuf whenever anybody came near me.
[2012/03/13 16:22]  Jamie Marlin: 🙂
[2012/03/13 16:23]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Jamie, exactly. I have prim public hair now, but only did it because people were criticizing me for being naked but without public hair. Being naked with public hair is more acceptable
[2012/03/13 16:23]  Scarp Godenot: ha ha Extie
[2012/03/13 16:23]  Alexi Flux: Well it’s worse when it shows through your clothing, Extie
[2012/03/13 16:23]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Extie, lolol
[2012/03/13 16:23]  Extropia DaSilva: It did that, too.
[2012/03/13 16:23]  Jamie Marlin: Talking genitals are near the top of my list of ‘antisocial things to do in SL’
[2012/03/13 16:23]  Zobeid Zuma: Haha! 🙂
[2012/03/13 16:23]  Scarp Godenot: Yes, for men, the genital thing would stick through clothing. That is until mesh.
[2012/03/13 16:24]  Enigma Bombay: talk about poor writing, the scripted emotes coming from SL genitals tend to be misspelled and, hmmm… inimaginative… I think there must be some kind of cottage industry selling sexual emotes just waiting to be born.
[2012/03/13 16:24]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): I think we embarassed Arisia with this talk of genitals
[2012/03/13 16:24]  Jamie Marlin: 🙂
[2012/03/13 16:24]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): oh, nothing worse than a talking pussy except a talking pussy with poor spelling
[2012/03/13 16:24]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Heh, almost wrote smelling there
[2012/03/13 16:24]  Enigma Bombay: my thoughts exactly 😉
[2012/03/13 16:24]  Scarp Godenot: haha
[2012/03/13 16:24]  Enigma Bombay: oh, we’ll have smell-o-vision in SL, it’s just a matter of time, I think.
[2012/03/13 16:25]  Scarp Godenot: First will come the pressure sensitive virtual body suit
[2012/03/13 16:25]  Enigma Bombay: yes 🙂
[2012/03/13 16:25]  Extropia DaSilva: The griefers would love smell o vision
[2012/03/13 16:25]  Scarp Godenot: so true!
[2012/03/13 16:25]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Well, prim gentials can be talken off when you want to put clothes on; I didn’t realize my public hair was showing through my clothes, but fortunately I don’t wear clothes
[2012/03/13 16:26]  Alexi Flux: I got kicked out of the Story of O sim cos I said it smelt faecal
[2012/03/13 16:26]  Alexi Flux: and banned
[2012/03/13 16:26]  Scarp Godenot: Has anyone ever attended the John Waters movie Polyester, that has with it scratch and sniff cards for various points in the movie?
[2012/03/13 16:26]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Alexi, you got banned from the Story of O sim?
[2012/03/13 16:26]  Enigma Bombay: no, but that sounds hilarious
[2012/03/13 16:26]  Extropia DaSilva: No Scarp first will be decent VR glasses. Sony have a pair for watching 3D movies already, only a mater tof time before they add an accelerometer and make them VR for immersive games. GTA in true VR! Ooooooo
[2012/03/13 16:26]  Alexi Flux: Yes, Rhi
[2012/03/13 16:27]  Scarp Godenot: That will be Awesome Extie, and I will be an early buyer!
[2012/03/13 16:27]  Alexi Flux: Pity really, I could have had some fun there in chat
[2012/03/13 16:27]  Zobeid Zuma: True VR is forever in the future.
[2012/03/13 16:27]  Extropia DaSilva: I disagree, Zo
[2012/03/13 16:27]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Hi Gwyn!
[2012/03/13 16:28]  Extropia DaSilva: Awww Gwyn the clocks changed.
[2012/03/13 16:28]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): It will probably be banned like in Shatner’s Tekwar, once it happens
[2012/03/13 16:28]  Scarp Godenot: True VR is forever in the future, but tech wise, things have come a LONG way in the last 4 years.
[2012/03/13 16:28]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh my. Did someone in the US change the hour a couple of weeks too soon?
[2012/03/13 16:28]  Enigma Bombay: yes, George Bush :/
[2012/03/13 16:28]  Enigma Bombay: damn him
[2012/03/13 16:28]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hrrmpf
[2012/03/13 16:28]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Gwyn, yeah, George W Bush
[2012/03/13 16:28]  Extropia DaSilva: Yes Gwyn. I only knew because Jamie told me on Sunday. Thank goodness for Jamie!
[2012/03/13 16:29]  Scarp Godenot: They have been experimenting in the US with both spring and fall dates for the last few years.
[2012/03/13 16:29]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Lucky you!
[2012/03/13 16:29]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Gwyn, you should be a member of my group; I notified *evaeryone* of the time change, putting it in GMT for the Europeans
[2012/03/13 16:29]  Extropia DaSilva: Mhmmm. I am very lucky to have her as a sister.
[2012/03/13 16:29]  Jamie Marlin: 🙂
[2012/03/13 16:29]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Good point, Rhi…
[2012/03/13 16:29]  Zobeid Zuma: Time changes seriously need to just go away. 😦
[2012/03/13 16:29]  Scarp Godenot: I think there have been studies that track productivity and GNP based on different daylight savings dates.
[2012/03/13 16:29]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Europeans and prety much the rest of the world….
[2012/03/13 16:30]  Jamie Marlin: Jamie Marlin agrees with Zo
[2012/03/13 16:30]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Scarp: yes, since 1920 or thereabouts 😛
[2012/03/13 16:30]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Zo, well, I like the extra hour of sun; if we didn’t have the standarized change, evveryone would have to set their hours one ahead; you know, start work at 10, instead of 9, etc.
[2012/03/13 16:30]  Extropia DaSilva: OK well one minute left so…Is Sl permissive or repressive when it comes to sexual noncomformists?
[2012/03/13 16:30]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Gwyn, Daylight szvings was before WWI, at least in America
[2012/03/13 16:30]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’d be repressive against daylight saving fanatics….
[2012/03/13 16:30]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): Woodrow Wilson did it to help his gold buddies
[2012/03/13 16:30]  Scarp Godenot: Permissive! the end.
[2012/03/13 16:30]  Jamie Marlin: Jamie Marlin votes ‘Permissive’, but respects everyones right to disagree
[2012/03/13 16:30]  Alexi Flux: Who is SL?
[2012/03/13 16:31]  Enigma Bombay: I think in SL one can find a spot that is permissive of what one wants to do, even if it’s not across the board, in every single sim, ad infinitum.
[2012/03/13 16:31]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
[2012/03/13 16:31]  Rhiannon of the Birds (rhiannon.dragoone): I think it is a balance of repression and permission, toward all deviants
[2012/03/13 16:31]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Indifference 😉
[2012/03/13 16:31]  Scarp Godenot: All nerds are created equal!
[2012/03/13 16:31]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh that’s a nice one, Scarp!
[2012/03/13 16:31]  Extropia DaSilva: OK my time is up!
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