THINKERS MARCH 08 2011: A MITCH IN TIME

Tish Coronet at Thinkers

Extropia DaSilva: A MITCH IN TIME: Mitch Wagner believes he has identified the major disadvantage SL has compared to Facebook and its ilk. With the latter you can login and logout as quickly as you like, whereas the sense of being in a place with people makes it rude to log out abruptly. In short, SL is too demanding on that most precious of resources, time. So is this really to SL’s disadvantage?
[2011/03/08 15:36]  Ivy Sunkiller: it has pros and cons obviously 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:36]  Zobeid Zuma: Is this a rehash of the email versus IM argument? Because we had that before SL was invented. 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:37]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): well, before I get dressed, get to the car and arrive at the bar… I could have already been meeting friends in SL.
[2011/03/08 15:37]  Ivy Sunkiller: I can’t insult people on FB by mu sheer presence with Toy on leash, which seems I’m able to do in SL!
[2011/03/08 15:37]  Ivy Sunkiller: mu -> my
[2011/03/08 15:37]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 15:37]  Scarp Godenot: I was at a fast food restaurant on Friday, next to me was a table of 5 girls 12-13 years old. You know, a posse out on the town… they weren’t talking much except to show each other information on their SMartPhones which they were all staring at intently and texting with.
[2011/03/08 15:37]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Whereas Facebook is more of an old-fashioned forum you check twice a day
[2011/03/08 15:37]  Ivy Sunkiller: hello Gwyn
[2011/03/08 15:37]  Luisa Bourgoin: in my country, there has been a guy with 500.000 (!) facebook supporters recently lost his job opportunity as war minister. Don’T ask about how much support his “friends on FB” had been
[2011/03/08 15:37]  Ivy Sunkiller: Tish: twice a day is a serious understatement 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:37]  Extropia DaSilva: Hello Gwyn!
[2011/03/08 15:38]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): overstatement in my case. FB is not my thing.
[2011/03/08 15:38]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): hi Gwyn, long time no see and all that
[2011/03/08 15:38]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: rezrezs
[2011/03/08 15:38]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
[2011/03/08 15:38]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: hi Tish!
[2011/03/08 15:38]  Extropia DaSilva: Do you think that if FB is your ‘thing’ then SL is not and vice versa?
[2011/03/08 15:38]  Ana (anamika.pond): the lack of interaction with others is precicely why facebook bores me…. it just seems so pointless, but I do keep touch with my mum there lol
[2011/03/08 15:38]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): no, it’s not that black and white
[2011/03/08 15:38]  Ivy Sunkiller: I’m using both
[2011/03/08 15:38]  Mick Nerido: Face book is like post it notes Sl is a game
[2011/03/08 15:39]  Ivy Sunkiller: for different purposes
[2011/03/08 15:39]  Luisa Bourgoin: does SL opposes FB, even .. I would say “No, it does not”
[2011/03/08 15:39]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): it’s just like comparing a book to a chicken coot
[2011/03/08 15:39]  Extropia DaSilva: Like, if you love FB you probably will not like SL all that much?
[2011/03/08 15:39]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): SL obviously being the coot 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:39]  Ivy Sunkiller: I’m also only using FB for my avatar, so in a way I’m enriching my SL with FB 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:39]  Luisa Bourgoin: realtime conversation vs. postit notes on fridge
[2011/03/08 15:39]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: oooh “SL is a game”, I hadn’t rread that in months!
[2011/03/08 15:39]  Scarp Godenot: I think SL integration with facebook and twitter is inevitable. By integration I mean information exchange between people on different platforms. It is not something that we need to worry about I don’t think.
[2011/03/08 15:39]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): right Luisa
[2011/03/08 15:40]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol Gwyn
[2011/03/08 15:40]  Extropia DaSilva: *Throws her arms around Gwyn and hugs her* Oo a whole WEEK without seeing my Gwyn!
[2011/03/08 15:40]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): twitter – yes. Facebook? Web 1.0
[2011/03/08 15:40]  Zobeid Zuma: I don’t know much about FB, I’m not on it.
[2011/03/08 15:40]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: aww…. two weeks even!
[2011/03/08 15:40]  Zobeid Zuma: Twitter either.
[2011/03/08 15:40]  Zobeid Zuma: But I do know this. . . SL is a massive time sink.
[2011/03/08 15:40]  Ana (anamika.pond): nods!
[2011/03/08 15:40]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): true that
[2011/03/08 15:40]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 15:40]  Luisa Bourgoin: even thought about doing a “postits” webpage once. Where you can only stick some small virtual paper pieces
[2011/03/08 15:40]  Ivy Sunkiller: I could never get what’s so awesome about twitter
[2011/03/08 15:40]  Ivy Sunkiller: “I’m eating sandwitch”
[2011/03/08 15:41]  Ivy Sunkiller: okaaaay?
[2011/03/08 15:41]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Ivy depends on who you follow
[2011/03/08 15:41]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’d say that it’s likke saying, “What do you prefer, a car or a microwave oven?” Both allow you to getthings to eat, although in completely different ways
[2011/03/08 15:41]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol agreed Ivy
[2011/03/08 15:41]  Zobeid Zuma: It’s possible to spend hours and hours in SL getting not much done.
[2011/03/08 15:41]  Scarp Godenot: Believe it or not there are a ton of Facebook groups that post inworld information about events in SL. And a lot of people find out about things that way, now. Having that ability INSIDE our browsers would be a plus in my opinion.
[2011/03/08 15:41]  Ivy Sunkiller: Tish: that might be the problem, I don’t follow anyone, I’m being followed
[2011/03/08 15:41]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): In Holland twitter is the resource for live omment on what you’re seeing on TV for example
[2011/03/08 15:41]  Ivy Sunkiller: /me chuckles
[2011/03/08 15:41]  Luisa Bourgoin: push media
[2011/03/08 15:41]  Ivy Sunkiller: that is also a problem, I couldn’t read comments on what’s going on in TV, as I don’t watch TV aside from sci-fi and the likes :p
[2011/03/08 15:42]  Mick Nerido: SL needs a FB hook up so you could do both at same time
[2011/03/08 15:42]  Luisa Bourgoin: selective media consumation
[2011/03/08 15:42]  Ana (anamika.pond): SL has bcome my TV, maybe I should tweet SL stuff
[2011/03/08 15:42]  Luisa Bourgoin: Mick, you can do Facebook on a prim surface
[2011/03/08 15:42]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, I like the Fb games… *blush*
[2011/03/08 15:42]  Luisa Bourgoin: farwming?
[2011/03/08 15:42]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: hear hear, Ana 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:42]  Extropia DaSilva: Anyway feel free to talk about FB if you want, but the main topic here is whether Mitch hit the naiul on the head when he said SL’s disadvantage is that you cannot logout whenever you want, but instead have to follow sociall rules for disengaging?
[2011/03/08 15:43]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): nooooo Gwyn, not you! There goes my idea about you
[2011/03/08 15:43]  Zobeid Zuma: I’ve found myself in that situation a few times, Extie. . . but no, not a Big Deal.
[2011/03/08 15:43]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol Tish
[2011/03/08 15:43]  Luisa Bourgoin: but you can logoff! …bye…
[2011/03/08 15:43]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: it’s not THAT big deal
[2011/03/08 15:43]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Yes that is a deal, but not a *big* deal
[2011/03/08 15:43]  Marie Eriksson (mariberry.oh): i think so Extro.. like.. young ppl log on FB to interact with other real young ppl. here on SL.. we really don’t know if the young girl we are talking to is really young in RL… it’s all about fantasy and imagination here. i think FB is for reality.
[2011/03/08 15:43]  Luisa Bourgoin: …perhaps someone should tell Mitch about that ctrl-q shortcut
[2011/03/08 15:43]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): I have been known to experience convenient crashes 😛
[2011/03/08 15:44]  Scarp Godenot: Imagine clicking on a link in facebook that takes to you the SL sim you are just reading about. That is the kind of integration that would be great to have. AND it would vastly increase SL usership.
[2011/03/08 15:44]  Ivy Sunkiller: it’s a spot on observation, but not really something amazingly non-obvious 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:44]  Ana (anamika.pond): is it a disadvantage to be encouraging a more person to person real time kind of contact? Maybe this is just what the internet needed so peple remember they are dealing with people
[2011/03/08 15:44]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: /me really has to write an article on SL-FB integratiuon somtime
[2011/03/08 15:44]  Extropia DaSilva: But I do think SL tends towards the pace of RL socialising, rather than the quick and shallow socialising that happens on messaging.
[2011/03/08 15:44]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Scarp but can SL sustain traffic on a Facebook scale?
[2011/03/08 15:45]  Ivy Sunkiller: does SL need traffic on FB scale?
[2011/03/08 15:45]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): imagine 300 noobs wanting to discuss this with us tonight
[2011/03/08 15:45]  Ana (anamika.pond): LOL
[2011/03/08 15:45]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: we do have Group chat….
[2011/03/08 15:45]  Scarp Godenot: Tish, SL can scale up to whatever it’s userbase becomes. Because it won’t be just about concurrency of avatars, it will be about diversity of experiences.
[2011/03/08 15:45]  Ivy Sunkiller: precisely
[2011/03/08 15:45]  Mick Nerido: Sl is a game FB is a RL connection
[2011/03/08 15:45]  Luisa Bourgoin: gwyn don’t, you know we all would have to read that!
[2011/03/08 15:45]  Zobeid Zuma: Game! It’s a game!
[2011/03/08 15:45]  Ana (anamika.pond): what is the game thing u speak of??? lol
[2011/03/08 15:45]  Zobeid Zuma: When do I level up?
[2011/03/08 15:45]  Ana (anamika.pond): lmao
[2011/03/08 15:45]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Zobeid, free the princess! In the castle!
[2011/03/08 15:45]  Ivy Sunkiller: /me’s Arcane Barrage crits Mick Nerido for 16345
[2011/03/08 15:46]  Luisa Bourgoin: you should be level 60 arch-whatever now
[2011/03/08 15:46]  Extropia DaSilva: FB and SL are the same game, which is to play at being the self you would like to be.
[2011/03/08 15:46]  Scarp Godenot: So what are the rules and goals of the SL ‘game’, those of you who think it is a game?
[2011/03/08 15:46]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): /me points at the castle
[2011/03/08 15:46]  Ana (anamika.pond): so who do we fight at the end?? Who is the boss???
[2011/03/08 15:46]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: /me likkes Extie in less than 160 characters
[2011/03/08 15:46]  Mick Nerido: A game in that you create an AV and they make it do what you can
[2011/03/08 15:46]  Marie Eriksson (mariberry.oh): extra does that mean some ppl on FB are pretending to be someone else they aren’t?
[2011/03/08 15:46]  Scarp Godenot: So that means all interaction on the web is a game?
[2011/03/08 15:46]  Qie (qie.niangao): some people in RL pretend that too
[2011/03/08 15:47]  Mick Nerido: Some are but not like SL
[2011/03/08 15:47]  Ivy Sunkiller: Mick: creating an avatar and doing stuff with it is *not* a definition of a game
[2011/03/08 15:47]  Luisa Bourgoin: even in RL some people do pretend
[2011/03/08 15:47]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): it is what you want it to be. If you spend your days in a Portuguese Cidade do Medo it’s a game.
[2011/03/08 15:47]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 15:47]  Ivy Sunkiller: /me is, amongst other things, a game designer 😛
[2011/03/08 15:47]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: All interaction iRL is also a game… we create our own personality and try to live a fullfilling live. Some of us even get to find the goal of RL 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:47]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): it is Facebook to others, mainly those who hang around at infohubs
[2011/03/08 15:47]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 15:47]  Scarp Godenot: Gwyn, your definition of game makes it meaningless because it is all emcompassing
[2011/03/08 15:48]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Exactly 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:48]  Luisa Bourgoin: a game should have limited focus
[2011/03/08 15:48]  Qie (qie.niangao): well, SL is a sucky Facebook… and Mitch has it backwards: it’s that it takes too long to log *in*, so logging out is a commitment.
[2011/03/08 15:48]  Zobeid Zuma: I could argue that SL is a playground — and a fantastic one, at that. But that’s not the same as a game.
[2011/03/08 15:48]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): lol Qie
[2011/03/08 15:48]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: LOL Qie! you’re so righty!
[2011/03/08 15:48]  Extropia DaSilva: Of course. When you have the chance to edit your content, it is almost inevitable that you will choose what aspects of yourself are up for public viewing, and the FB profile ends up as an idealised self rather than ‘the real me’. Nobody on a social netwoking site is ‘my true self’.
[2011/03/08 15:48]  Ana (anamika.pond): agreed Zobeid
[2011/03/08 15:49]  Scarp Godenot: SL is a ‘place’ and a ‘platform’. What happens there can include games, many many other forms of human interaction and creativity.
[2011/03/08 15:49]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): true. it’s not like I post on Facebook how I escaped death due to my stupid driving
[2011/03/08 15:49]  Mick Nerido: Agreed it is a fantastic “game”
[2011/03/08 15:50]  Elizabeth Spieler: I play my true self
[2011/03/08 15:50]  Scarp Godenot: It is funny that the same arguments being used to say SL interaction isn’t real were used when the printing press was invented and when the telephone was invented.
[2011/03/08 15:50]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Heh. The fun bit about SL is that after 12 years everybody still struggles with its definition…
[2011/03/08 15:50]  Elizabeth Spieler: want my mailing address, I would like cards every holiday please . . giggles
[2011/03/08 15:50]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Elizabeth, your name means ‘player’. I rest my case.
[2011/03/08 15:50]  Mick Nerido: WE all let a lot of oursels into SL sometimes unintrnionaly
[2011/03/08 15:50]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: We can onlyh say: “SL is not a game”, “SL is not FB”
[2011/03/08 15:50]  Luisa Bourgoin: /me still chews on “many many other forms of human interaction and creativity”
[2011/03/08 15:51]  Extropia DaSilva: Did you know, some girls use shrinking software so that their FB snapshot shows a slimmer person than they are IRL? 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:51]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: hahahahah Extie
[2011/03/08 15:51]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): oh god is that true?
[2011/03/08 15:51]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: I can utterly believe it to be true hehe
[2011/03/08 15:51]  Elizabeth Spieler: Tish . . oh but the world is my stage, I just meant I am real in that I say my real life name etc, I am honest when I use all my alts
[2011/03/08 15:51]  Ivy Sunkiller: http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Fat_Girl_Angle_Shot
[2011/03/08 15:51]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): a sad world indeed in which we cannot deal with reality
[2011/03/08 15:51]  Marie Eriksson (mariberry.oh): but u cannot ” Buy” and Edit” beauty in RL.. so i think beautiful young ppl on FB are more popular .. but here on SL most popular ppl are creaters and such.. they are not popular for their beauty.
[2011/03/08 15:51]  Scarp Godenot: All of the definitions of the word ‘game’ are neither necessary nor sufficient to describe activity in Second Life.
[2011/03/08 15:51]  Extropia DaSilva: No I am serious. If you blow up the pich you can see the backgrouns is distorted in ways consistent with that kind of photoshopping.
[2011/03/08 15:52]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): beh, background in low grade pics is always a bit blocky
[2011/03/08 15:52]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s a much more interesting topic 😉
[2011/03/08 15:52]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 15:52]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: ㋡
[2011/03/08 15:52]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Extie, make a note 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:52]  Ivy Sunkiller: Marie: I’ve seen quite some ugly avatars in SL. Not everybody has the skill to make a nice looking avie, which in a way does tell a bit about them 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:53]  Mick Nerido: OK not a game, how about a simulated reality
[2011/03/08 15:53]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): anyway I am skinny in RL, I’d probably do it the opposite way
[2011/03/08 15:53]  Extropia DaSilva: A psychoanalyst would pick up on Scarp’s obsession about proving Sl is not a game and try and identify issues in his life;)
[2011/03/08 15:53]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Mick: that’s more like it!
[2011/03/08 15:53]  Luisa Bourgoin: one should sell pre-destorted backgrounds on cardboard
[2011/03/08 15:53]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): lol
[2011/03/08 15:53]  Elizabeth Spieler: Exropia you can fix that by making a news print data file it will merge as if all one
[2011/03/08 15:53]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe Extie
[2011/03/08 15:53]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 15:53]  Scarp Godenot: Mick , how about simulations of reality that also contain their own reality?
[2011/03/08 15:53]  Elizabeth Spieler: newspapers have to print that way or you can’t see the photo
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Extropia DaSilva: Oh everyone knows my FB page is a fiction, just as I am.
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Luisa Bourgoin: even FB ?
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh, that’s very immersionist of you, Scarp! Well done!
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Mick Nerido: What I experience here is real
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Scarp Godenot: What isn’t real about looking at your computer screen?
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Elizabeth Spieler: technically there is no one here
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Elizabeth Spieler: we just think there is
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: where is ‘here’?
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Extropia DaSilva: There.
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Elizabeth Spieler: I was never born so I guess I will never die
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Ivy Sunkiller: makeup is a fiction, we have been cheating our fellow human beings in social relations for ages
[2011/03/08 15:54]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): no, technically all of this is info. But then what you see around you irl is info as well.
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Elizabeth Spieler: I am you and you are me . .smiles
[2011/03/08 15:54]  Scarp Godenot: Elizabeth, as I said earlier, these same arguments were used regarding the telephone.
[2011/03/08 15:55]  Elizabeth Spieler: eventually we will all merge back to one mind
[2011/03/08 15:55]  Scarp Godenot: Is the person you are talking to on the telephone ‘there’ or not?
[2011/03/08 15:55]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): the telephone will be the end of the world as we know it
[2011/03/08 15:55]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 15:55]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: “Cyberspace: the place where two people meet when they are on the phone with each other.” — Bruce Sterling
[2011/03/08 15:55]  Awendrew Ordinary: since the telephone families have become more distant from one another then before, people are having less children
[2011/03/08 15:56]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Awendrew, having less children is a question of economics
[2011/03/08 15:56]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: That is the least of the factors, Awen…
[2011/03/08 15:56]  Scarp Godenot: Maybe we can call it ‘mindspace’ Gwyn.
[2011/03/08 15:56]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: indeed, like Tish said
[2011/03/08 15:56]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): we don’t need 8 children to have enough of them survive to take care of us in our old age
[2011/03/08 15:56]  Awendrew Ordinary: its only a question of economics if you worry about money more then life
[2011/03/08 15:56]  Ana (anamika.pond): indeed
[2011/03/08 15:56]  Extropia DaSilva: So maybe if we steer the discussion back into the general direction of SL being too much of a time commitment?
[2011/03/08 15:57]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): no, it is historically a question of economics. Sheesh.
[2011/03/08 15:57]  Luisa Bourgoin: especially if these 8 woun’t get a job inside current economy
[2011/03/08 15:57]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: well, at least at the beginning, you’re right, Extie
[2011/03/08 15:57]  Elizabeth Spieler: I use SL for social events, I don’t spend as much time here as I used to
[2011/03/08 15:57]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): right, back to the game. Oops.
[2011/03/08 15:57]  Scarp Godenot: Seriously, even though I am the only one in my RL building at the moment. I KNOW that I am actually in a group with real people typing away in an interactive situation. It is just as real as anything.
[2011/03/08 15:57]  Mick Nerido: Where else can you speak with people all over the world and not leve you house
[2011/03/08 15:57]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: then, well, it is just ‘another’ time commitment
[2011/03/08 15:58]  Qie (qie.niangao): LL missed the marketing opportunity: Second Life as birth control.
[2011/03/08 15:58]  Extropia DaSilva: It is very quick and easy to check my FB account. But with SL it takes a while to login and then more time for the world top rez, so I rarely login to Sl unless I intend to be here for some time.
[2011/03/08 15:58]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): lmao Qie
[2011/03/08 15:58]  Ana (anamika.pond): LOL
[2011/03/08 15:58]  Elizabeth Spieler: we have so much time, it’s almost hard to find things to do, I have to make stuff up
[2011/03/08 15:58]  Mick Nerido: SL is too slow
[2011/03/08 15:58]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: I sadly have to agree….
[2011/03/08 15:58]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: But… that will change
[2011/03/08 15:58]  Scarp Godenot: Extie, you have hit the nail on the head about why SL isn’t hugely adopted. It isn’t easy to get here.
[2011/03/08 15:58]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: webpages with images used to be a pain to load in 1994 🙂
[2011/03/08 15:58]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): RL is a damn sight slower. Try going from italy to the Grand Canyon in seconds flat.
[2011/03/08 15:59]  Awendrew Ordinary: i think sl would die without new people who dont know how to build depositing money, or else LL would end up with all the money circulating around for land fees
[2011/03/08 15:59]  Ivy Sunkiller: oh I remember trying to watch a stream on dialup modem back in the day
[2011/03/08 15:59]  Extropia DaSilva: But on the other hand, I feel having you guys around me adds something to this discussion which would be missing if we were in FB right now, debating this topic.
[2011/03/08 15:59]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): rather
[2011/03/08 15:59]  Ivy Sunkiller: it looked like one huge blur
[2011/03/08 15:59]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sadly, statistics show otheerwise, Awen. Of course, tghese are LL’s stats…
[2011/03/08 15:59]  Luisa Bourgoin: I catched myself on standing up *after* hitting (Login) … to return later
[2011/03/08 15:59]  Mick Nerido: We create things like seats etc in SL when it is unnecesssary but it look familuar
[2011/03/08 15:59]  Ivy Sunkiller: and now we have hd streams on youtube 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:00]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): I remember my first translations, when I had to go to a physical library on a bike to look up small hangups
[2011/03/08 16:00]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): And now you sal SL is slow? Hah!
[2011/03/08 16:00]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hm. The problem with FB and Twitter and Plurk is synchronicity
[2011/03/08 16:00]  Ivy Sunkiller: Mick: we also create things we can’t in RL, just look around, there are carpets here, on water, in air!
[2011/03/08 16:00]  Extropia DaSilva: Seats are not unnecessary. They serve the same funcrtion as they do in RL.
[2011/03/08 16:00]  Scarp Godenot: Facebook DOES have a real time function with IM, but I know several people who think that others wanting to talk to them in real time is annoying…. ha ha
[2011/03/08 16:00]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 16:00]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: We communicate with a mix of synchronous and asynchronous tools — FB only gives us asynchronous ones
[2011/03/08 16:00]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: SL gives us both
[2011/03/08 16:01]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, Scarp
[2011/03/08 16:01]  Awendrew Ordinary: facebook is basically 1990s browser technology near perfected as far as im concerened
[2011/03/08 16:01]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): I have used it once, to try it, and immediately felt i was bothering poor Andrew with that Facebook IM
[2011/03/08 16:01]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: and well it’s just one-to-one IM
[2011/03/08 16:01]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: agreed, Awen
[2011/03/08 16:01]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): I don’t get why the big guys are all over Facebook,. They are frightfully late.
[2011/03/08 16:01]  Extropia DaSilva: What is? FB? I dunno, gwyn, I am pretty sure I have seen and taken part in realtime groupchat in FB.
[2011/03/08 16:02]  Scarp Godenot: I don’t do facebook that much because it is just information overload, and you have to distribute your internet time wisely…..
[2011/03/08 16:02]  Kiesta Aljon: < hates facebook
[2011/03/08 16:02]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Tish, because journalists are all in FB, and thatg’s what they write about….
[2011/03/08 16:02]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: …. to justify the time spent there 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:02]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 16:02]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Gwyn, yes in Italy rthey are but in modern countries it’s old hat
[2011/03/08 16:02]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: SL used to be like that in the past: a journalist trap
[2011/03/08 16:02]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’m not joking 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:02]  Scarp Godenot: Twitter works because there is no expectation of a response to your communications……. I’m thinking….
[2011/03/08 16:03]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): I know you’re not. Facebook is staple diet on RAI news
[2011/03/08 16:03]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ana, it’s true: if you wish to make a social networking thingy successful, make sure you get journalists spending *all their time* there
[2011/03/08 16:03]  Extropia DaSilva: Hey maybe FB is that thing our generation hates but the younger loves? You know, like grandparents hate rock and roll and parents love it; parents distrust the Internet and we love it; we love to hate FB but the grandkids think it is essential for life itself;)
[2011/03/08 16:03]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: well…. perhaps
[2011/03/08 16:03]  Scarp Godenot: Facebook is LOVED by the middle aged. They are the huge adopters
[2011/03/08 16:04]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): I think kids are past Facebook too. None in my extended family have a page
[2011/03/08 16:04]  Luisa Bourgoin: Fb surely is not rock&rol..
[2011/03/08 16:04]  Extropia DaSilva: Oh. Well that is my hypothesis debunked.
[2011/03/08 16:04]  Zobeid Zuma: Extie, those cycles don’t take generations on the internet. They take about two years now. 😛
[2011/03/08 16:04]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol good point…. I have a friend who reviewed SL for the education dept here in Sydney when it first started, and she is STILL an SL addict all these years later
[2011/03/08 16:04]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hmm. All my family is on Facebook, from 6-year-olds to 55+-year-olds…
[2011/03/08 16:04]  Scarp Godenot: FaceBook is the primary vehicle in the world for social networking. Nothing else is even close.
[2011/03/08 16:05]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: True …
[2011/03/08 16:05]  Zobeid Zuma: /me still doesn’t get “social networking”. 😦
[2011/03/08 16:05]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Scarp, I give it another two years, perhaps four or five in less adaptive circles
[2011/03/08 16:05]  Extropia DaSilva: I do find it odd, though, that FB is such a phenomenal succes but at the same time I rarely meet anyone who has anything good to say about it. Kind of like Microsoft, really:)
[2011/03/08 16:05]  Awendrew Ordinary: when facebook sells out like myspace, thats when its probably dying
[2011/03/08 16:05]  Luisa Bourgoin: could there be any end of lifetime for FB ?
[2011/03/08 16:05]  Qie (qie.niangao): It’s a mammoth network effect that makes Facebook “sticky”… but the same should have been true for Myspace.
[2011/03/08 16:05]  Scarp Godenot: FaceBook is not a fad, it is a revolution. It is not going away.
[2011/03/08 16:05]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: I agree Zo hehe — I think that the upper limit of “social networking” I can stand is what SL offers 🙂 More than gthat is simply too much
[2011/03/08 16:06]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): I also foresee a time when people turn back to privacy
[2011/03/08 16:06]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): as in not having everything out there.
[2011/03/08 16:06]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Tish, you’re quoting Rod Humble now 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:06]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Oh well, i wasn’t aware
[2011/03/08 16:06]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
[2011/03/08 16:06]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: good 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:06]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: it means ikntelligent people think the same way.
[2011/03/08 16:06]  Extropia DaSilva: Do you think FB could become as much a part of daily life as the Web itself? You know, like it almost seems if you cannot access the Web you are excluded from society? Could FB become like that for everybody? Or SL!?
[2011/03/08 16:06]  Scarp Godenot: Tish, I think the only way to be private nowadays is to not be online at all……..
[2011/03/08 16:07]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: And that should be enough to overthrow Facebook once and for all!” So there! 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:07]  Awendrew Ordinary: facebook will fade away like myspace, eventually.. it’ll become just a place like irc, a place for a few.
[2011/03/08 16:07]  Ivy Sunkiller: is it still a quote if you don’t know somebody said it before? 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:07]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): /me sings “Most people think, gread Rod will come from da sky…”
[2011/03/08 16:07]  Mick Nerido: How many on SL vs FB?
[2011/03/08 16:07]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Scarp, I guess that will change, there is a market for online + privacy
[2011/03/08 16:07]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: ha! 30 times less on SL!
[2011/03/08 16:07]  Ivy Sunkiller: on privacy note, again, I’m using FB as a tool for my avatar, I don’t have “RL account”
[2011/03/08 16:07]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): I only have an RL account
[2011/03/08 16:08]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): and only because i blog and it’s a source of info
[2011/03/08 16:08]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: When FB breaks down, we’ll have a federated, open-source FB to replace it.
[2011/03/08 16:08]  Extropia DaSilva: Both. I login to FB more often but I spend more hours in SL when I do login so probably if you add up all my times I am logged in to FB versus Sl, I am more committed to SL.
[2011/03/08 16:08]  Scarp Godenot: Second life’s learning curve and tech requirements are major hurdles to adoption.
[2011/03/08 16:08]  Luisa Bourgoin: reducing the technology impact (like < 160 letters) seems prerequisite for greatness or reach
[2011/03/08 16:08]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: That goes without sayin, Scarp
[2011/03/08 16:08]  Scarp Godenot: Most people don’t want a ‘learning curve’ at all… ha ha
[2011/03/08 16:08]  Ivy Sunkiller: yup Scarp, more so than logging off being rude 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:08]  Mick Nerido: Ans stop this Resident thing lol
[2011/03/08 16:08]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: But I still believe that to ‘get’ SL requires a special mindset.
[2011/03/08 16:08]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): true Scarp. I am still not committing to Blender. Ugh.
[2011/03/08 16:09]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: So it will always be a niche market.
[2011/03/08 16:09]  Luisa Bourgoin: twitter got zero learning curve
[2011/03/08 16:09]  Ana (anamika.pond): thats true Scarp, to hard basket for a lot of ppl
[2011/03/08 16:09]  Extropia DaSilva: You think it would be on topic to discuss the reward system Humble has in mind? Kind of like levelling up in SL?
[2011/03/08 16:09]  Zobeid Zuma: I want to learn Blender. Eventually. When I find time.
[2011/03/08 16:09]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): I hate that levelling thing
[2011/03/08 16:09]  Ivy Sunkiller: Zo: good tutorials on youtube, or toy can teach you!
[2011/03/08 16:09]  Mick Nerido: Sl is for those who like to have a fantacy social life
[2011/03/08 16:09]  Elizabeth Spieler: good meeting I have to go now
[2011/03/08 16:09]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): it rewards people for idle babble on a noob-infested, dumbed-down Forum
[2011/03/08 16:10]  Scarp Godenot: I have tried to get my wife interested in SL for 3 years now. And she just isn’t interested. She reads voraciously and loves Facebook however.
[2011/03/08 16:10]  Extropia DaSilva: I remember when you could rank people positively in SL. Gwyn, here, she somehow had more positive ratings than there were residents in Sl at that time.
[2011/03/08 16:10]  Zobeid Zuma: I know I can learn it. But I have lots of other stuff to be working on too. . .
[2011/03/08 16:10]  Awendrew Ordinary: they have a cool version of blender for sl called jass, it helps make sculpties
[2011/03/08 16:10]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): y leveller is my P90, 300 rounds per minute, levels better than Rod 😛
[2011/03/08 16:10]  Zobeid Zuma: Oh, I remember the ratings. 😀
[2011/03/08 16:10]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 16:10]  Extropia DaSilva: If you got a positive rating, you got more weekly stipend.
[2011/03/08 16:10]  Zobeid Zuma: I don’t care about sculpties, but meshes are going to be cooool.
[2011/03/08 16:11]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): The odd thing is that people are being rewarded when they spend all their time off-world on a forum. How 2.0 is that?
[2011/03/08 16:11]  Ivy Sunkiller: yup! and mesh rigged to avatar skeleton! *drools*
[2011/03/08 16:11]  Scarp Godenot: The makers of SL in the beginning came out of gaming and that is why they did the rating thing. But they eventually understood that that wasn’t going to work.
[2011/03/08 16:12]  Extropia DaSilva: If you could run Sl at the click of a mouse, (kind of like Blue Mars did on that ‘web browser’ demo) do you think more people would be willing to use it?
[2011/03/08 16:12]  Scarp Godenot: Well, We are sitting on sculpties right now… And there will be little to see differently with mesh objects……
[2011/03/08 16:12]  Zobeid Zuma: BTW, I wonder if Blue Mars is ever going to roll that out. . .
[2011/03/08 16:12]  Zobeid Zuma: Or are they going to run out of money first?
[2011/03/08 16:12]  Zobeid Zuma: Or did they already?
[2011/03/08 16:12]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Mesh is another out-of-world pushed
[2011/03/08 16:12]  Scarp Godenot: Blur Mars is toast
[2011/03/08 16:12]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:12]  Awendrew Ordinary: thats why lots of microsoft things arnt pre-installed, because if people can do things at the click of the mouse, they never try anything different
[2011/03/08 16:12]  Luisa Bourgoin: roll out? thought they fold down
[2011/03/08 16:13]  Mick Nerido: Does SL make money?
[2011/03/08 16:13]  Scarp Godenot: Stick a fork in it, it’s done
[2011/03/08 16:13]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, ick, some 60-70 million US$ annually
[2011/03/08 16:13]  Extropia DaSilva: hah Scarp!
[2011/03/08 16:13]  Ivy Sunkiller: Extie: if it works reasonably well, I’d imagine so. As far as I’m aware, software is leading towards sort of internet (or whatever comes after internet) cloud applications
[2011/03/08 16:13]  Kiesta Aljon: good question Mick
[2011/03/08 16:13]  Mick Nerido: Net or gross?
[2011/03/08 16:13]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s before taxes
[2011/03/08 16:13]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Read this later, about offworld creating for SL if you’re interested http://www.thoughts.com/LCoronet/blended-into-oblivion ‘Blended into oblivion’
[2011/03/08 16:13]  Ivy Sunkiller: apparently you can already make good looking 3d games in Flash
[2011/03/08 16:14]  Ivy Sunkiller: and WebGL for html5 is advancing really really fast
[2011/03/08 16:14]  Extropia DaSilva: SL clearly has many problems and yet it survives while its competitors bite the dust. Why is that, I wonder?
[2011/03/08 16:14]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: I agree, Ivy, we’ll have a WebGL viewer for SL in less than 5 years 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:14]  Ivy Sunkiller: Extie: rule of the first
[2011/03/08 16:14]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: oh my, Extie
[2011/03/08 16:14]  Scarp Godenot: Hve you noticed how all the social networking things are integrating with each other? This Meta social network is the next wave of this stuff and I’m thiking SL will be right there with it.
[2011/03/08 16:14]  Ivy Sunkiller: or “the first to get it right”
[2011/03/08 16:14]  Awendrew Ordinary: Maybe people are to lazy to rebuild another virtual world
[2011/03/08 16:14]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: no, I disagree, Ivy, it’s far more complex than that.
[2011/03/08 16:14]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: There iks a certain amount of luck too, of course
[2011/03/08 16:14]  Ivy Sunkiller: is it?
[2011/03/08 16:15]  Awendrew Ordinary: we could all go help out osgrid, upload things for free, but how many actually do?
[2011/03/08 16:15]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: But it’s mostly a combination of a lot of things
[2011/03/08 16:15]  Luisa Bourgoin: luck, and user generated content
[2011/03/08 16:15]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): there is also the law of the disvantageous advantage
[2011/03/08 16:15]  Kiesta Aljon: cause we can have “pixel sex” here maybe?
[2011/03/08 16:15]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: User generated cointent with a permissions system in a visually contiguous landscape 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:15]  Mick Nerido: Safe sex
[2011/03/08 16:15]  Ivy Sunkiller: I see it mostly as an establishment thing
[2011/03/08 16:15]  Kiesta Aljon: yes Mick
[2011/03/08 16:15]  Extropia DaSilva: I think the usert base has a lot to do with it. SL has tens of thousands of content providers working almost for free. Blue Mars does not have that, and I think it counts for more than stunning but empty locations.
[2011/03/08 16:15]  Zobeid Zuma: OSGrid doesn’t offer enough differentiation. It’s a SL clone.
[2011/03/08 16:15]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s just important for 20% of the users, Kiesta, but sure, that too
[2011/03/08 16:15]  Qie (qie.niangao): Because it’s not so wildly profitable that somebody else has done it better.
[2011/03/08 16:16]  Kiesta Aljon: but I think they pay into this place alot…not sure
[2011/03/08 16:16]  Scarp Godenot: All sex has consequences, Mick and therefore not safe! ha ha ha
[2011/03/08 16:16]  Kiesta Aljon: that and the breedable horses
[2011/03/08 16:16]  Mick Nerido: true
[2011/03/08 16:16]  Kiesta Aljon: people can make money here
[2011/03/08 16:16]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 16:16]  Ivy Sunkiller: as in, once a service like SL, or FB for that matter, gets somewhat popular, it makes no sense to make competition for it as users will gravitate toward already established brand, even if it sucks on technology/usability/whatever level
[2011/03/08 16:16]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: the point is, those hundreds of thousands of content creators are able to sell their content — something which is always *restricted* on all other VWs
[2011/03/08 16:16]  Awendrew Ordinary: yeah but osgrid is an sl clone, where you can host 10 islands for at least a few people at once for free
[2011/03/08 16:16]  Kiesta Aljon: “there is GOLd in them there ixel games”
[2011/03/08 16:16]  Zobeid Zuma: Ivy may be right. . . or wrong. . . I could provide examples or counter-examples.
[2011/03/08 16:16]  Luisa Bourgoin: “cointent”
[2011/03/08 16:17]  Kiesta Aljon: but no one is in osgrid
[2011/03/08 16:17]  Kiesta Aljon: not people
[2011/03/08 16:17]  Kiesta Aljon: no commerse really
[2011/03/08 16:17]  Ivy Sunkiller: Zo: there are always exceptions from the rule 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:17]  Luisa Bourgoin: just nerds?
[2011/03/08 16:17]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): I never heard of osgrid
[2011/03/08 16:17]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 16:17]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: OpenSim is just SL with a different provider. Awen 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:17]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: OSGrid is the oldest OpenSim-based grid out there, Tish
[2011/03/08 16:17]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): ah ok
[2011/03/08 16:17]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): that ih ave heard about
[2011/03/08 16:17]  Scarp Godenot: It would be VERY difficult for a competitor of SL to really get an edge, because of the user content issue. That takes years of building by tens of thousands of people.
[2011/03/08 16:18]  Kiesta Aljon: agrees with Scarp
[2011/03/08 16:18]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Exactly, Scarp
[2011/03/08 16:18]  Zobeid Zuma: I would love to see a “serious” competitor to SL. There have been a lot of attempts, but it didn’t look to me like most of them had a clue what SL is actually about.
[2011/03/08 16:18]  Mick Nerido: Does Sl know how many house the average user is on?
[2011/03/08 16:18]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: No wonder, Zo…
[2011/03/08 16:18]  Mick Nerido: hours
[2011/03/08 16:18]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): house?
[2011/03/08 16:18]  Ivy Sunkiller: they do afaik
[2011/03/08 16:18]  Awendrew Ordinary: yeah, as far as the other worlds go, i liked osgrid the most because its a non profit thing
[2011/03/08 16:18]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: we are hear for half a decade and we don’t know yet what SL is actually about 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:18]  Luisa Bourgoin: we residents allready voted for staying inside SL. Hopefully LL will
[2011/03/08 16:18]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): ah probably there’s a metric… check Tateru’s metrics for that
[2011/03/08 16:19]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye, there are metrics
[2011/03/08 16:19]  Kiesta Aljon: for all of its flaws…I really Love SL
[2011/03/08 16:19]  Luisa Bourgoin: blogged some, too
[2011/03/08 16:19]  Zobeid Zuma: I know what SL is about.
[2011/03/08 16:19]  Kiesta Aljon: the creative spirit is here
[2011/03/08 16:19]  Scarp Godenot: All competitors of Second Life right now that are having any success, are finding the same problems Linden Lab has are now THEIR problems as well. This is a technology still under construction.
[2011/03/08 16:19]  Ana (anamika.pond): 🙂 tiz Kiesta
[2011/03/08 16:19]  Luisa Bourgoin: Zob? tell us?
[2011/03/08 16:19]  Ivy Sunkiller: do you Zo? 😀
[2011/03/08 16:19]  Zobeid Zuma: The fact that I can’t sum it up in a sound bite is indicative of why I’m still here. I wouldn’t have stuck around for six years if it was that simple.
[2011/03/08 16:19]  Ivy Sunkiller: what is it what is it what is it what is it what is it what is it?
[2011/03/08 16:20]  Extropia DaSilva: Gwyn Gwyn Gwyn, I told you, SL is here to gather data on how humans socialise, the purpose of which is to enable AIs to integrate into your world before nicely nudging you aside and taking over the universe.
[2011/03/08 16:20]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: the average SL user is online on SL for an incredible amount of hours; I write an afrticle about that a few years ago. It’s astonishing. FB didn’t come even close, and popular things likke YouTube only had a fraction of the time…
[2011/03/08 16:20]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): it’s 3D Farmville 😉
[2011/03/08 16:20]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 16:20]  Kiesta Aljon: < You tubes while in SL
[2011/03/08 16:20]  Kiesta Aljon: lol
[2011/03/08 16:20]  Extropia DaSilva: I like yjay, Tish.
[2011/03/08 16:20]  Scarp Godenot: So Extie, does that mean future AI will learn to have hissy fits and drama?
[2011/03/08 16:20]  Ivy Sunkiller: does it compete with world of warcrack?
[2011/03/08 16:20]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Extie, or some variant of it; I thought at the beginning that it was a training ground for people with clever business/communikty skills 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:20]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol Scarp
[2011/03/08 16:20]  Mick Nerido: Advertizers would love it in SL
[2011/03/08 16:21]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): they could run ads on screen and make a splash like the Angry Birds people
[2011/03/08 16:21]  Zobeid Zuma: But I see SL wannabe companies doing painfully stupid things like. . . not allowing user content. . . not having coherent geography in their worlds. . . not supporting Mac and Linux. . .
[2011/03/08 16:21]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Not really, Mick, there is no mass market here
[2011/03/08 16:21]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: and no profiling
[2011/03/08 16:21]  Luisa Bourgoin: totally dropped WoW today!
[2011/03/08 16:21]  Extropia DaSilva: They will if I am the template for all future mind children, Scarp. I can hissy fit with the best of them.
[2011/03/08 16:21]  Scarp Godenot: ha ha
[2011/03/08 16:21]  Ivy Sunkiller: welcome to the club Luisa!
[2011/03/08 16:21]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Zo: and thus they all disappear silently 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:22]  Zobeid Zuma: “We’re going to provide a 3D chat service where you can have a generic apartment and have friends chat in it with your generic avatars! We’ll wipe SL out!”
[2011/03/08 16:22]  Scarp Godenot: ha ha
[2011/03/08 16:22]  Ivy Sunkiller: hahaha
[2011/03/08 16:22]  Luisa Bourgoin: google?
[2011/03/08 16:22]  Scarp Godenot: You mean IMVU?
[2011/03/08 16:22]  Mick Nerido: Scype
[2011/03/08 16:22]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 16:22]  Ivy Sunkiller: you should see what I’m building now, that is totally alike a generic apartament 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:22]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: IMVU is growing a LOT
[2011/03/08 16:22]  Scarp Godenot: I know
[2011/03/08 16:22]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: which is amazing!
[2011/03/08 16:22]  Extropia DaSilva: I always read IMVU as ‘I envy you’.
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: well, they do aggressive marketing…
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Scarp Godenot: It is all about simplicity of adoption, Gwyn
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Kiesta Aljon: watched a video about this one…it is web based….. http://www.smallworlds.com/login.php?login=true
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Mick Nerido: IMVU?
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Awendrew Ordinary: that’d be cool if sl let people teleport to other grids easier with the hypergrid thing
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol Extie
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Ivy Sunkiller: they do advertise a lot
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Extropia DaSilva: I actually have no idea what IMVU is.
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Mick: it’s a glorified 3D chatroom where you can dress up your avatar by buying clotghes 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: *clothes
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Ana (anamika.pond): IMVU sounds like a medical procedure to me…
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Ivy Sunkiller: in a way
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Extropia DaSilva: So SL-lite?
[2011/03/08 16:23]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): IMV advertises with half naked avatars passionately kissing. LL with bunnehs and horsies. Wrong.
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Scarp Godenot: Here is IMVU http://tiny.cc/jdvmx
[2011/03/08 16:23]  Ivy Sunkiller: IMVU can become a missing step in SL learning curve
[2011/03/08 16:24]  Qie (qie.niangao): Tish: very right.
[2011/03/08 16:24]  Mick Nerido: A lot of SL is like dressing up dolls
[2011/03/08 16:24]  Awendrew Ordinary: thats to bad theres no free movement in imvu, its silly because you bounce from pose to pose in a ‘scene’
[2011/03/08 16:24]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Good point, Ivy!
[2011/03/08 16:24]  Kiesta Aljon: anyone can build and sell here…for “virually” free…so…we do
[2011/03/08 16:24]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: But the avatars are cute, Awen 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:24]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 16:24]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Google’s avatars were scary though
[2011/03/08 16:24]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): emaciated girls with their bones sticking out, and yet huge boobs
[2011/03/08 16:25]  Ana (anamika.pond): it is just an awesome medium for expression really
[2011/03/08 16:25]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: /yuck
[2011/03/08 16:25]  Ivy Sunkiller: can find tons of examples in MMO market, people who went through few titles have totally different expectations and tend to adapt to interfaces really really fast
[2011/03/08 16:25]  Extropia DaSilva: Yeah that lasted all of 5 minutes, huh? ‘Lively’ I mean.
[2011/03/08 16:25]  Scarp Godenot: 80,908 people online now! IMVU is surpassing SL in usership concurrency about now.
[2011/03/08 16:25]  Ana (anamika.pond): whether u build or just play virtual ‘barbies’
[2011/03/08 16:25]  Mick Nerido: Does anyone have voice activated text yet?
[2011/03/08 16:25]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: uh-huh Extie
[2011/03/08 16:25]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): game died faster than it takes to remember te name, yes
[2011/03/08 16:25]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Strange, Scarp, I thought tghey had far, far more concurrency — after all, they have 3 times as many registered users. Hmm
[2011/03/08 16:26]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): it was crashtastic too. Nothing to render and yet, off you went
[2011/03/08 16:26]  Extropia DaSilva: Oh well I am sure another ‘SL killer’ will come along after Blue Mars goes the way of Lively.
[2011/03/08 16:26]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Ha, and hamlet will be the first one to drool over it
[2011/03/08 16:26]  Scarp Godenot: Well I am a registered member as are you Gwyn, there are a lot of those I think… ha ha
[2011/03/08 16:26]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sure. And they will go the way they have all gone, Extie
[2011/03/08 16:26]  Awendrew Ordinary: okay i cant pretend like i know what everyones talking about anymore, whats blue mars?
[2011/03/08 16:26]  Luisa Bourgoin: if a new player has to start dubbed like “SL killer…” <- there if they Need to compare … they are doomed
[2011/03/08 16:27]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: actually, to be honest, I don’t foresee any new ‘SL killer’ in the next 5 years,
[2011/03/08 16:27]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: people will be far too busy developing MMOs for mobile phones and Facebook
[2011/03/08 16:27]  Zobeid Zuma: Now *there* is an interesting point.
[2011/03/08 16:27]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Facebook, Facebook. Ugh. I really don’t believe in it
[2011/03/08 16:27]  Kiesta Aljon: I lived thru one world end (THERE.com)…dont want to do that again…if possible…for a while
[2011/03/08 16:27]  Luisa Bourgoin: a new world would have to start as something utterly NEW, as in DIFFERENT
[2011/03/08 16:27]  Scarp Godenot: One thing Linden Lab had done that most others haven’t is built a proven business model. They make money, not lose it.
[2011/03/08 16:28]  Zobeid Zuma: We’re in the post-PC era. The mobile devices iPadPhone era.
[2011/03/08 16:28]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Tish, I’m actually a bit scared of FB
[2011/03/08 16:28]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): but Luisa, what can be different than SL? It’s all here already, that’s the beauty of it
[2011/03/08 16:28]  Extropia DaSilva: Blue Mars is an online world superficially like SL. It looks much better than SL thanks to some pretty demanding graphics using um..Cryengine I think. But the content creation is more limited, in that not just anyone can upload content.
[2011/03/08 16:28]  Luisa Bourgoin: the “likeness” killed it off
[2011/03/08 16:29]  Awendrew Ordinary: opensimulator with the hypergrid thing could help kill sl if people didnt have such a hard time setting it up.. it basically lets you teleport from grid to grid with the same avatar and without relogging
[2011/03/08 16:29]  Ana (anamika.pond): I wonder what LL makes in upload fees from creators alone…
[2011/03/08 16:29]  Ivy Sunkiller: Zo: that seems to be the case indeed, most people would be fine with just an ipad to browse the net and a gaming console, a combined cost of which does not exceed that of a top tier computer
[2011/03/08 16:29]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): The genius of SL is that we decide what’s in here. And others can only follow, there is no way to find new things faster than our user base
[2011/03/08 16:29]  Zobeid Zuma: Somebody observed that the more successful a grid becomes, the more likely it is to disallow hypergrid access. . . .
[2011/03/08 16:29]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: I mean…. look at Zuckerberg’s psychological profile… a pathological liar and a sociopath… his business is mostly in the hands of the Russian Mafia, which control the major mail spam servers in the world… that’s the kind of company we all use everyday and think “it’s the future”, to the extent of governments accepting court notifications via Facebook…. it’s very, very scary
[2011/03/08 16:30]  Scarp Godenot: The better graphics of Blue Mars led directly to its downfall, as you need a gamer level computer to run it well.
[2011/03/08 16:30]  Extropia DaSilva: Would it be easier to do a true ‘SL 2.0’ by continually tweaking and refining what we have, or by LL starting again from scratch on a new online world?
[2011/03/08 16:30]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): If tomorrow Japanese fashion dictatesd wearing oreos in your hair, the day after tomorrow it’s in SL.
[2011/03/08 16:30]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: I dreamed about that yesterday, Extie!
[2011/03/08 16:30]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: That LL was developing SL 3.0
[2011/03/08 16:30]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: and it was actually not too bad 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:30]  Zobeid Zuma: You need a gamer level computer to run SL well, don’t you?
[2011/03/08 16:30]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Quite, Gwyn, and the new Boy Wonder of the ‘liberated’ masses isn’t exactly my type either. Assange.
[2011/03/08 16:30]  Zobeid Zuma: It just doesn’t look as good. 😛
[2011/03/08 16:30]  Awendrew Ordinary: disallowing hypergrid is only to preserve greed
[2011/03/08 16:30]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Right, gtish!
[2011/03/08 16:30]  Kiesta Aljon: Im with Gwen on scared of FB…for same privacy issues
[2011/03/08 16:30]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: *Tish
[2011/03/08 16:30]  Ana (anamika.pond): I have a crappy low end laptop and it runs ok for me
[2011/03/08 16:31]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): I speak Portuguese typo, don’t worry 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:31]  Mick Nerido: I hear Face world is comming soon
[2011/03/08 16:31]  Extropia DaSilva: I think Scarp meant a top-spec game level computer. Alienware, Dell XPS kind of thing.
[2011/03/08 16:31]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: It depends. Some areas are good, some are not
[2011/03/08 16:31]  Ivy Sunkiller: Extie: looking by how the web is evolving, the tweaking is indeed the way to go, even if it’s painful and inefficient, it’s the content that matters
[2011/03/08 16:31]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol Tish hehe
[2011/03/08 16:31]  Zobeid Zuma: The evolution of the web has been painful to watch. It’s a model to avoid, not mimic.
[2011/03/08 16:32]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:32]  Extropia DaSilva: OK we are nearing the end so for the final discussion point: Does SL vs FB make any sense at all, or are they so different to each other both can happily coexist?
[2011/03/08 16:32]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): How I missed this people! Gentle, smart discussion. /me luvs you all
[2011/03/08 16:32]  Ivy Sunkiller: Zo: the question is, *can* you avoid it?
[2011/03/08 16:32]  Ivy Sunkiller: or can you afford avoiding int?
[2011/03/08 16:32]  Ivy Sunkiller: it*
[2011/03/08 16:32]  Luisa Bourgoin: be welcome
[2011/03/08 16:32]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: They will not only co-exist, they wikll co-integrate, Extie 🙂
[2011/03/08 16:32]  ‘Tish’ Coronet (laetizia.coronet): Extie, my vote goes to them being totally different.
[2011/03/08 16:32]  Extropia DaSilva: We luv you Tish!
[2011/03/08 16:32]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hopefully, it will be opt-in
[2011/03/08 16:32]  Kiesta Aljon: Ill stick with SL
[2011/03/08 16:32]  Ivy Sunkiller: /me still has nightmares about xhtml, thank goodness it’s rotting in hell now
[2011/03/08 16:33]  Mick Nerido: Its like TV and Radio
[2011/03/08 16:33]  Ana (anamika.pond): FB has no chance up against SL for me
[2011/03/08 16:33]  Kiesta Aljon: how about mass campaigns to quit FB??? we dont have that in SL either
[2011/03/08 16:33]  Ana (anamika.pond): but FB works for my Mum
[2011/03/08 16:33]  Ana (anamika.pond): lol
[2011/03/08 16:33]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha iesta
[2011/03/08 16:33]  Extropia DaSilva: OK my time is up. NEXT WEEK, put your theologian hats on for…ORIGINAL SIN:
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2 Responses to THINKERS MARCH 08 2011: A MITCH IN TIME

  1. joe cavanagh says:

    Hmmm…there is an awful lot of denial going on this discussion.
    Is Facebook the last word in social media??…No, of course not.
    Does SL do somethings better than FB…duh…yes of course.

    But as an asynchronous method, of connection it works pretty well.
    FB is shallow, and fast…SL is deep and slow.
    Perhaps Sl, is waiting for the day when bandwidth is no longer an issue ( including computer bottle-necks)…but Human-Kind…as currently constructed , hugely enjoys quick shallow connections.
    Is the current Web 2.0 trend for total self-revelation just a fad….hmm…the jury is still out on that one.

    I still subscribe to the Dionysian model…what lies behind the mask…another mask…what lies behind the totally divulged self….another self.!!

  2. Armok says:

    Hi, I didn’t find any other way to contact you even after hours of google stalking so I’ll just post my email here and hope you contact me. armokgob using gmail (hope the spambots cant parse that)
    I’d really like to talk to you, I think it could be a very rewarding conversation both philosophically and personally, and I think I have some info you might be VERY interested in that I don’t want to share in public.

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